विकिपीडिया:चौपाल/पुरालेख 3 - विकिपीडिया

# विकिपीडिया:चौपाल/पुरालेख 3

### विकिपीडिया, एक मुक्त ज्ञानकोष से

< विकिपीडिया:चौपाल

## [संपादित करें] हिन्दी अनुवाद

मैं सत्यजित राय लेख का अंग्रेजी से अनुवाद कर रहा हूँ। कोशिश है कि यह अंग्रेजी विकिपीडिया की तरह यहाँ भी निर्वाचित लेख बने। इस लेख में फ़िल्म जगत से जुड़े कुछ विशेष शब्द हैं जिनका अनुवाद करने में मुझे सहायता की जरूरत होगी। इनमें से पहले दो से शुरुआत कर रहा हूँ। -- दाढ़ीकेश ०५:१०, १ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

1. Documentary: मुझे याद नहीं आ रहा कि दूरदर्शन पर इसके लिये क्या शब्द प्रयोग होता था। शायद मैं हमेशा "Documentary" शब्द देखते ही चैनल बदल देता था!
2. Trilogy: इसके लिये क्या "तिकड़म" शब्द उपयुक्त रहेगा?

    I support you; if we translate सत्यजित राय fully, it will be our 2nd featured article :-)! In Bengali Documentary is প্রমাণ্যচিত্র ; transliterating to प्रमाण्यचित्र. Or maybe प्रमाण-फ़िल्म or प्रलेख-फ़िल्म?--वुल्फ़वार्ता ११:३४, १ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
      वॄत चित्र ? --122.167.147.176 १६:०७, १ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
        documentary film की सही हिंदी है वृत्त चित्र और trilogy की तिकड़ी या त्रयी -- पूर्णिमा वर्मन १७:०१, १ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
          धन्यवाद! कुछ और शब्द - alien, sequel, masterpiece, negative, flash-back. -- दाढ़ीकेश ०७:२६, ८ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
            alien = अंतरिक्षवासी या बाहरी(किस संदर्भ में है जानना ज़रूरी है। कृपया पूरा वाक्य लिखें), sequel=शेष, परिणाम या उत्तरकथा (उपन्यास या फ़िल्म के संदर्भ में), masterpiece= श्रेष्ठ कृति, negative=नकारात्मक, flash-back= पूर्व दृश्य (लेकिन हिंदी में 'फ्लैशबैक' काफ़ी इस्तेमाल होता है तो जैसा का तैसा ही हिंदी में भी प्रयोग कर सकते हैं। पूर्णिमा वर्मन २१:२०, ९ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
              धन्यवाद पूर्णिमा जी, alien अंतरिक्ष के संदर्भ में ही था। मैंने दूरग्रहवासी लिखा था, अंतरिक्षवासी बेहतर रहेगा। Negative फ़िल्म के संदर्भ में है, फ़िल्म का निगेटिव, इसके लिए कोई हिन्दी शब्द हो तो बताएँ। एक और - Swan song, मतलब किसी कलाकार की आख़िरी कृति, इसके लिए कोई उपयुक्त शब्द होगा? -- दाढ़ीकेश २२:१५, ९ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

                फ़िल्म के निगेटिव के लिए प्रतिचिञ शब्द है तो सही लेकिन उसका प्रयोग बहुत ही कम होता है। निगेटिव शब्द का प्रयोग ही सामान्य रूप से होता है। हो सकता है कि आप हर जगह प्रतिचिञ शब्द का प्रयोग करें तो यह प्रचलन में आ जाए जैसे कि धर्मयुग ने transparency के लिए पारदर्शी शब्द का प्रयोग करना शुरू किया और यह शब्द प्रचलन में आ गया। अगर हिम्मत और जोश की कमी है तो निगेटिव ही ठीक है। -- पूर्णिमा वर्मन १८:२७, २४ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

                    Swan song के लिए शायद अंतिम कृति या अंतिम रचना ठीक रहेगा। -- पूर्णिमा वर्मन २०:१०, २४ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  Maybe but रुहोल्ला खोमैनी‎, जांग चिंग and Mahadevi varma have more content and are better referenced at the moment.राजा रामबात करो २२:३३, २ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

      मै आपकी मदद करने को तैयार हुँ ----सदस्य:husaini

        अन्तरिक्षवासी translates, I guess to someone who lives in space and perhaps not an alien from another planet. Maquahuitl ०३:१३, १६ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

## [संपादित करें] अन्य संस्करणों में

क्या अन्य संस्करणों में मुखपृष्ठ में बदल करने समय आते है? अब अप्रैल है। शायद बांग्लादेश निबंध बांग्ला विकिपीडिया का निर्वाचित लेख से। मेरा प्रस्ताव यहाँ है: Template talk:मुखपृष्ठ अन्य संस्करणों में। सारांश अनुवाद हो गया, लेकिन चेक कर ज़रूरत है। कृपया आपका मतामत दें। धन्यवाद।--वुल्फ़वार्ता ०८:२४, ६ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

## [संपादित करें] featured articles

In order of most ready to least ready we have:

1. महादेवी वर्मा (she is most relevant as well, being a hindi poet)
2. सत्यजित राय
3. जांग चिंग
4. रुहोल्ला खोमैनी

राजा रामबात करो ०२:५३, ७ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

Let's vote on this now.

  What exactly are we voting on? There are a lot more articles that are close to being featured. I am adding them to विकिपीडिया:निर्वाचित लेख परख so that we have a better idea about them. There we can also discuss what exactly each article needs to become featured. -- दाढ़ीकेश २०:१०, ७ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

रुहोल्ला खोमैनी needs a rewrite because of grammar . Deeptrivia १४:४७, ९ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  No surprise lol, I wrote the page.राजा रामबात करो ००:३७, १० अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

## [संपादित करें] यूएसए बोट

This is what Eukeshजी wrote:

> I have the database of Ganeshbot and also of all cities of Nepal. However, I am having my exams right now. So, will be able to work on that after a week. Also, if soemone has database of other entities (cities, rivers) please provide it to me. I am also working on US cities that can add 10,000 articles. However, its upto the community to decide whether to let me create those articles. There is another bot in English which creates articles about American cities (I forgot the name sorry abt that). If someone can get me that database, it would be even better. Also, I am working on satellites and redierction bots. If someone can lend me a hand, please feel free to do so. Thank you.--युकेश १६:३१, ६ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

What is the opinion of the समाज?--वुल्फ़वार्ता ०९:०३, ११ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  My thought is that they need to be fully translated to Hindi before being created as articles. Setting them up as user subpages like Ganeshbot did on en.wiki and translating them there before merging them in might work. - टैक्सवाला १७:५१, ११ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

    Actually translating them will be easier in the database itself. I can start working on that if it can be sent over email to me. longhairandabeard_AT_yahoo_DOT_com. -- दाढ़ीकेश १९:२२, ११ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

      What kind of translation it would be? Would it be mere stubs or some contents? As there was discussion on improving quality not quantity, we should not add large number of stub articles through bot. --मितुल २०:४३, ११ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

        I think the concern was more with one-liner articles that add no encyclopedic value at all. A proper stub provides a definition of the subject and is big enough not to be entirely useless. Ganeshbot makes stubs that have enough content to provide some value. See, for example, en:Dharuhera. There is definition, geographic information (including location on a map), and demographic information. This information should be enhanced, of course, through manual editing, but even this would be useful as a starting point for someone who searched for the name of the town. -- दाढ़ीकेश ००:५६, १२ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

          आधार के क्वालिटी के बारे में युकेश ये बोलते है: They are similar to the articles created by Ganeshbot. Its legitimate stub but still its stub. I just wanted to express that we can create similar articles, but its upto the community to decide whether we need them or not. I think that it is a good idea. The stubs' content would be like this: bpy:ট্রিপ কাউন্টি, সাউথ ডাকোটা. Please have a look at this: Botopedia! So many different countries' legitimate content stub bots! Please give your thoughts!!!--वुल्फ़वार्ता ०९:००, १२ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

            We can start working on the bot. We can create the database (it takes a lot of time to transliterate) also I am working on the locator-map. I didnt know about the botopedia project and wikidata thing. I think all the indic scrpits should work together to transliterate it piece by piece and use software like girgit for inter-transliteration. Using or not using the data to create the articles might be an option but I think it is mandatory for us to have such databases in devnagari or any of the indic scripts. We should not lag in having such databases. Thanks.--युकेश १६:५०, १२ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

                  If someone clicks Special:Random and a city page comes up, at least seeing ganeshbot's pages there will be a little content there, however right now, we generally get one liners solets try and do this as fast as we can.राजा रामबात करो १७:५६, १५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

## [संपादित करें] Important to the Community

With a stroke of luck, I have found the system files for the Hindi Wikipedia interface. I have been luck enough to change the template namespace to साँचा, and now it is the time to choose whether to user Hindu numbers (123) or Devanagari numbers (१२३) in all automated dates and years etcetera. I have set up a poll. Please sign your preferred box, and leave a comment. Thank you.

नाम | समर्थन
--- | ---

यूरोपीय हिंदू-अरबी संख्या

- वुल्फ़वार्ता १५:१४, १२ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
- टैक्सवाला १७:५०, ८ मई २००७ (UTC)

देवनागरी संख्या

- Maquahuitl ०८:४०, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
- सुमित सिन्हावार्ता
- बैर्नार १३:२४, ३० अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
- राजा रामबात करो १६:०२, ३० अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

जो संख्या प्रथम प्रयोग हुवा है उसे रखके दुसरा संख्या को रिडिरेक्ट करना

- युकेश १६:५५, १२ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

Here is the current file: http://svn.wikimedia.org/viewvc/mediawiki/trunk/phase3/languages/messages/MessagesHi.php?view=markup&pathrev=21192. Please choose as soon as possible, since the new software update will go up in a few days.--वुल्फ़वार्ता १५:१४, १२ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

    Just a bit of information to help you make up your mind (:-) from my point of view): the Government of India and almost ALL major Hindi news websites use the Roman numerals, and we have already made all date articles (1 जनवरी-25 दिसंबर) and year articles (e.g. 1805) with the Roman numerals.--वुल्फ़वार्ता १७:००, १२ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
      I would like to vote for consistency. But then we need to decide what numerals to use as a whole in the wiki, including the date articles, and dates within articles. Is there a consensus on that yet? Also, the enwiki places great emphasis on the fact that wikipedia is NOT a democracy. So instead of a poll, we should call it consensus building or something similar, with the objective of getting everyone (not just a simple majority) to see one side of the issue. So, please also explain your reasons for supporting either one, so that others can make a more 'informed' decision. -- दाढ़ीकेश १७:०७, १२ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

        Well our website does not matter as we can move the pages. I dont have much access to the Hindi text but most of the Varanashi based Hindi text that I see here in Nepal are written in Devnagari including the numbers. Thanks. --युकेश १७:१०, १२ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

          I travelled to Kolkata recently and found almost no trace of numerals written in Devanagari in Hindi. Also, as I said earlier, almost every Hindi news website uses Hindi numerals, The Government of India does and so does the केंद्रीय हिंदी निदेशालय, the official Hindi regulator: have a look at information about them: http://hindinideshalaya.nic.in/hindi/introduction.html and their main website: http://hindinideshalaya.nic.in/. Thank you.--वुल्फ़वार्ता ०९:३१, १३ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

            If the oficial regulator of Hindi dictates the use of Roman numeral, there is no point in discussion. We have to use the Roman numerals.Thanks.--युकेश ०१:३७, १४ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

              OK, shall I request it now then?--वुल्फ़वार्ता ०७:०२, १४ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

                I , think we should use devnaagri numerals--सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

As दाढ़ीकेशji said, please explain why. I have explained why I believe we should use roman (because the official regulator हिन्दी निदेशलया and भारत सरकार uses it). शुक्रिया, और विकिपीडिया पर आपका स्वागत है!--वुल्फ़वार्ता ०७:४७, १४ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

Hindi is not just language of India it is also used in many other countries hence if Indian gov doesn't uses dev numerals then it doesn't means the we all also stop using dev numerals . the place from where i am is lko in UP here i see many ppl using dev numerals even UP education board uses dev numerals . my mean is tht we must use Hindi as the way it is not by modifying it I would again say that essence of hindi are related to hindi numerals--सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

  Can you please show some official regulation/source? By the way, my geographic skills aren't that good... out of interest, where are Lko and UP?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १४:१२, १६ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

    Although I dont have any official source but I studied in Indian school and those students who studied Hindi used Devnagari script for Hindi. I think we can write a letter to a few official regulators and see what they have to say on that. Maybe Purnika Barmanjee can help us out in this. Thanks. Btw UP=Uttar Pradesh (it is northern state of India south to Nepal) lko=>maybe Lucknow???.--युकेश १६:२०, १६ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

      Well this is what Sumitji wrote on my user talk page:

“ | I and for using Devanagari numerals my suggestion is that Hindi is not just language of India it is also used in many other countries hence if Indian gov doesn't uses dev numerals then it doesn't means the we all also stop using dev numerals . the place from where i am is lko in UP here i see many ppl using dev numerals even UP education board uses dev numerals . | „

      Now, UP is in India (not any other country). Let me rephrase my question then: "What does the majority of the Hindi-writing world use? Are there any more official regulations?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १७:१५, १६ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
      Oh, and by the way, this is what Magical Saumy (one of the first on this Wikipedia) had to say:

“ | Use the international form of the Hindu-Arabic numerals (1,2,3 instead of १,२,३), as used by the Constitution and the Government of India (even for Hindi). | „

      --वुल्फ़वार्ता १७:२०, १६ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

        What is the protocol on other wikipediae, especially Indian languages'?Maquahuitl

          Marathi = Dev., Sanskrit = Dev., Urdu = Hindu-Arabic, Nepali = Dev. (but in automated things Hindu-Arabic), Kashmiri = Dev/Hindu-Arabic, Gujarati = Guj., Romani = Hindu-Arabic, Sinhala = Hindu-Arabic, Sindhi = Hindu-Arabic, Bhojpuri = Hindu-Arabic/Dev., Pali = Dev., Punjabi = Pun.. But, the languages which use their original form of numerals use the original form widely outside Wikipedia. Also, the usage of Hindu-Arabic numerals is by भारत सरकार, केंद्रीय हिंदी निदेशालय and केंद्रीय हिंदी संस्थान.--वुल्फ़वार्ता १३:५५, १७ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

          Shall I request it now then?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १३:३९, १८ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

            Well I advocate sticking with Devanagari numerals, since all other wikipidiae which have their own numerals use it. Still among the small-city population Devanagari numerals are popular.

Maquahuitl १०:१९, २३ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

But I don't think that is the point, what other Wikipedias use. I think what is most important is what the majority of Hindi writers use.--वुल्फ़वार्ता १४:१७, २३ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  And also, we have lots of pages; for example 1885 and 25 दिसंबर which have already been made with the Hindu-Arabic numerals. Is it worth changing all of them. But sorry, I have gone off the point. I believe that the majority of Wikipedias use what their official regulator(s) recommend. Is this not true?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १२:४१, २४ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

    I think that we need to use what is officially accepted. If we have a lot of confusion, we can request the official bodies of Hindi to clear up the issue. We need to know whether both systems are accepted or only one of the two is accepted. If they have a certain system for it, we HAVE TO follow it. If they say that both the Devnagari and Hindu-Arabic adapted by Latin are acceptable, we can form a consensus and use whatever is more comfortable for us. Thanks.--युकेश १५:१४, २४ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

      In my opinion, we can never leave either of them. When someone writes in Hindi, he uses १,२,३ etc. Most of our literature, like Ramayana etc and most publications use devnagari numerals like Geeta Press etc. Since, Roman Numerals are also being used now-a-days (Hinglish Culture), we need a space for them also in Hindi Wikipedia. Let's pick one and let's not ignore the other one. Let me explain... We can create 1885, 1886 etc pages with #REDIRECT# command to १८८५, १८८६ and I don't think it's bad. We can use roman numerals predominantly and should have a way to change to devnagari numerals at any point. But it would be wrong to just pick one and ignore the other one completely. It should just be left optional to users to pick whatever scheme of numerals they choose, what we can do is to convert and show in one consistent scheme on the page. Moreover, it does not really affect the quality of article.

Thanks मनीष वशिष्ठ - 24 अप्रैल् या २४ अप्रैल्

    I am sorry to have to disagree with you, but I believe that we should stick to one scheme. :-( वुल्फ़वार्ता १६:५७, २४ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

      काफ़ी समय से भारत सरकार और संबंधित विभागों द्वारा रोमन अंकों को हिंदी में मान्यता दे दी गई है। (शायद 1965 का आसपास, ठीक तारीख और किस आदेश के तहत दी गई यह मुझे अभी याद नहीं है पर इसको ढूँढा जा सकता है।) सरकारी दस्तावेज़ों, पत्र-पत्रिकाओं यहाँ तक कि साहित्यिक पत्रिकाओं जैसे ज्ञानोदय, वागर्थ (कागज़ी संस्करण में) और हंस [1] भी रोमन अंकों का प्रयोग होता हैं। जागरण [2], वेबदुनिया [3] और अमर उजाला[4] रोमन अंकों का प्रयोग कर रहे है। अभिव्यक्ति [5] और अनुभूति [6] में भी रोमन अंकों का प्रयोग किया गया है। अनेक प्रमुख हिंदी प्रकाशकों जैसे हिंदी बुक सेंटर[7], राजपाल एंड संस, भारतीय ज्ञानपीठ और किताबघर प्रकाशन द्वारा भी रोमन अंकों का प्रयोग किया जाता है। दिल्ली से प्रकाशित होने वाली भारत सरकार के केंद्रीय हिंदी निदेशालय की साहित्यिक पत्रिका 'भाषा' और लखनऊ से प्रकाशित होने वाली सूचना एवं जनसंपर्क विभाग की पत्रिका 'उत्तर प्रदेश' में भी रोमन अंकों का ही प्रयोग किया जाता है। यद्यपि एक प्रमुख हिंदी पत्रिका 'कादंबिनी' आज भी देवनागरी अंकों का प्रयोग कर रही हैं और व्यक्तिगत तौरपर मुझे देवनागरी अंकों से बहुत प्रेम है (मैं भी लखनऊ की हूँ सुमित) पर मेरे विचार से बहुमत, प्रमाणिकता और एकरूपता के लिए विकिपीडिया में रोमन अंकों का प्रयोग ठीक रहेगा। -- पूर्णिमा वर्मन १९:४३, २४ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

        Some points to note-
        1. Please don't go by what people "popularly" use. If popular usage is a justified criterion then we don't need a Hindi and an Urdu wikipedia; just having a "Hindustani" wikipedia in a language full of English words should be the choice since that is that common usage. 'Registered Hindi' is spoken absolutely nowhere in the country, but still that is what we strive for here. Secondly this popularity argument is very shallow because it only takes into account the people of big cities whereas majority of our population lives in small towns and villages.
        2. We are facing this problem because decimal system was invented in India and that is why wikipedia policy on this issue of other Indian languages and Arabic/Persian etc. IS an issue. If they are using native numerals, then why is it so. It cannot be that European decimal numerals have not made inroads into other lingual territories of India. Therefore what other Indian language wikipediae are using IS an issue. Even more so because we Indian language wikipediae are trying to co-ordinate. How can then this thing be ignored.
        3. Somebody said that Devanagari numerals are not used in Kolkata. While somebody else is claiming that the Indian Government is also not using it. A small point that I would like to make is that Devanagari not being used in Kolkata then it is of no consequemce since it is not a Hindi speaking area. Secondly, Indian government is no final authority on Hindi because as somebody said Hindi is spoken all over the world, especially in countries like Suriname, Mauritius etc. World Hindi conference has been held several times in Suriname.As far as GoI is concerned, then it also considers Hindi and Urdu as different languages. Does that make it true?
        4. A lot of people in Hindi speaking areas, especially those of small towns use Devanagari letters. Since wikipedia is a people's initiative, this must be taken into account.
        5. I support Manish's proposal of having redirects. We cannot completely ignore the other system either but we must stick to the spirit of Hindi. If in vocabulary then why not in number system.
        6. Purnima ji, please don't give a reference of Amar Ujala or Dainik Jagran. They use a language extremely polluted with English. Why are we then striving here for a high standard of Hindi?

          Also guys, the name of the English numerals is Hindu-Arabic numerals, not Roman numerals. Roman numerals are different. :) Maquahuitl ०८:४०, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  No offence meant but I think that there might be more people who understand and use Hindi in Kolkata (let alone West Bengal) than in Surinam, Mauritius and Trinidad combined. Thanks. --युकेश १६:५३, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

      मैं भी Maquahuitl के विचारों से सहमत हूँ। कारण यह है कि मान लीजिये हम Hindu-Arabic numerals/Roman numerals को मानक मान भी लें पर फिर भी काफी सारे सदस्य देवनागरी numerals का प्रयोग करते रहेंगे और विकीपीडिया में हमेशा incosistency बनी रहेगी। मनीष वशिष्ठ १२:४३, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

        I do not speak Hindi very well, but I would like to ask if Hindi is polluted with English nowadays? And also, since Wikipedia is an encyclopedia, can we have some examples of what other Hindi encyclopedias use? Also, I do not think that Wikipedia should be a way to preserve traditional Hindi. Also, Hindi is used a lot in Kolkata, and even some Hindi newspapers are published there. Oh, and people also live in the megacities. But just I can not decide here, I am no-one here at Wikipedia with my very low Hindi level. What does Mitulji and the others have to say?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १५:१४, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  Come on guys, lets cut it out yaar! Lets not take it personally. We are all equals here and Wolfji please remove that I am no-one part, you singlehandedly transformed a lot in Hindi wikipedia. OK, here is my say. The British and the Americans had a similar problem with the use of the English spelling and according to what I know, they have decided to maintain the article in the form in which it is written first and the other form to be redirected to the page. If we do not want a consensus on this thing, we can do the same here. Thanks. --युकेश १५:५०, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

    Hmm, that's a good idea, but what do we do inside articles. Actually, I should have listened to what you said earlier. We should write a letter to केंद्रीय हिंदी निदेशालय. That is what Marathi Wikipedia did when they had some spelling problem I think. Look at this: mr:विकिपीडिआ:चावडी/जुनी_चर्चा_८#A_help_request. We should write the letter in Hindi. Who could help create the letter at this page maybe: विकिपीडिया:हिन्दू अरबी व देवनागरी अंक विवाद. What do you think?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १६:३५, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

      Here are the contact addresses which can be of use: http://hindinideshalaya.nic.in/hindi/contactus.html - they don't have an e-mail adress, but they have a नई दिल्ली post address, fax and phone.--वुल्फ़वार्ता १६:४०, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  I think that we need to write to Hindi nirdeshanalaya. We need to ask whether they accept both systems or only a single system. If they say that they strongly accept only Hindu Numeral Latinized system (and not Roman), I think that it might be better to follow them unless someone comes up with another organization (which regulates Hindi) with a command and authenticity greater than this organization. However, if they say that both systems are acceptable, lets use first come first serve basis. As regards the use of numbers in the content, they stay in their form which was originally written. Thanks.--युकेश १६:५३, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

देवनागरी या रोमन अंको का प्रयोग!! यह प्रश्न पहने भी मुझे आया था। तारीखो के लेख बनाते समय शायद। तब कुछ लोगो की राय ली और रोमन को देवनागरी के उपर चुना। अधिकतर जगह रोमन अंको का प्रयोग होता है, इस तर्क पर। और तब से लेखो पर रोमन अंको का प्रयोग करता आ रहा हूँ, विशेषत: जहाँ तारीखो का प्रयोग होता है। यह मेरे लिए थोडा असुविधाजनक साबित हुआ है। जब भी अंको का प्रयोग करना होता है तो अंग्रेजी और हिन्दी लिखने के बीच अदल-बदल करना होता है। अब अगर हम देवनागरी अंको को मानक बनाते है तो जहाँ-जहाँ रोमन अंको का प्रयोग हुआ है, उसे बदलना होगा। दोनो ही मुश्किल है। रोमन अंको का प्रयोग जारी रखना कम मुश्किल लगता है। सो, मेरा मत रोमन अंको को मानक बनाए रखने मे है।
Devnagari numerals or Roman!! seemed an old question to me. Probably, when I had to create date articles. Consulted few people and choose roman over devnagari, because it was more widely used. Since then I have been using roman numerals, specially for dates. It has been little inconvenient for me. Whenever I have to use numerals, I have to switch between hindi-english typing. Now, if we favor devnagari over roman, we had to change wherever we used roman. Both are difficult. It seems to be less difficult to carry on using roman numerals. So, I think we should keep using roman numerals.--मितुल २१:३१, २७ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  Hello,
  I am not a Hindi native speaker, but I would like to give some imput about this issue. I think we should take care not to be taken away by .new and fast changing habits. Speaking Hinglish has become a fashion, as using Hindu-Arabic numerals has too. That should not be a criteria for choosing which numerals are used here. Let get proper advice for knowledge people, i.e. universities, Hindi writers, etc. Also changing what is used upto now should not be a criteria. I am ready to help moving all date and year articles if needed. Regards, Yann १८:०७, २८ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  I have changed roman to Hindu numerals. Roman refers to VII, IV, XCM, and so on, not 1,2,3.राजा रामबात करो ०२:५२, २९ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

    Instead of writing to universities and Hindi writers it would be most appropiate to write to केंद्रीय हिंदी निदेशालय (hindinideshalaya.nic.in Kendriya Hindi Nideshalaya, "Central Hindi Directorate") or केंद्रीय हिंदी संस्थान (hindi.nic.in, Kendriya Hindi Sansthan "Central Hindi Organisation"), the official regulators of Hindi, of which I gave the contact details earlier in the discussion.--वुल्फ़वार्ता ०७:२८, २९ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

      This is an endless debate. I withdraw from my stance of using Devanagari numerals and propose that let the articles who have already used some particular numeral system be as they are. New articles will use whatever the editor wishes to use. The only need here is that articles with titles having numbers(like years' articles) use one system for consistency. Maquahuitl ०८:५१, २९ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

        So what do we do with the automated date/time stamp (०८:५१, २९ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC))?--वुल्फ़वार्ता ०७:१८, ३० अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

मुझे लगता है कि देवनागरी संख्याओं का इस्तेमाल करना चाहिए। जैसे कि यान कहता है अंग्रेज़ी संख्याएँ सिर्फ़ आज का शौक़ है और जो लिख चुका है वह हम बहुत आसानी से बदल सकते हैं। और यह भी है कि लिखते समय हिंदी और अंग्रेज़ी कीबोर्ड के बीच अदल-बदल करता रहना मुश्किल है। बैर्नार १३:४३, ३० अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  मुझे लगता नहीं है जो हिंदी और अंग्रेज़ी कीबोर्ड के बीच अदल-बदल मुश्क़िल है कारण अनेक हिंदी टाइपिंग सिस्टम है जो डीफ़ॉल्ट रूप से हिंदु अरबी अंक इंस्टॉल्ड है। और आज का शौक़ तो क्या? तब क्यों हम खड़ी-बोली हिंदी अभ्यास करता हैं? क्यों संस्कृत-हिंदी अभ्यास करता नहीं हैं? जैसेः लेख - निबंध, ख़ास - विशेष, लॉग इन - सत्रारंभ, लॉग आउट - सत्रान्त, पन्ना - पृष्ठ, ज्ञानकोष - विश्वज्ञानकोष/विश्वकोष, इत्यादि। मेरा विचार है तो हम केंद्रीय हिंदी निदेशालय को एक चिट्ठा भेजता है। प्रश्न है: एक मुक्त और मुफ़्त विश्वज्ञानकोष जो सभी को संपादन कर सकता है पर क्या देवनागरी या हिंदु अरबी अंक अभ्यास करना संभव है? मैं यह चर्चा में आगे सभी योगायोग डीटेल्स देता था। जो चिट्ठा को लिखता है, कृपया यहाँ आराम्भ करें: विकिपीडिया:हिन्दू अरबी अथवा देवनागरी अंक विवाद (Hindu Arabic or Devanagari numerals dispute)। धन्यवाद।--वुल्फ़वार्ता १५:२९, ३० अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

    I have noticed that all the South Asian Wikipedias have used what is used widely (not everywhere) outside Wikipedia.--वुल्फ़वार्ता १५:३०, ३० अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

      Again the same popularity argument. I am saying it again that if popularity is the basis then why at all are we asking "Hindi" words for this and that here? The kind of language we are trying to use on Hindi wiki is spoken nowhere at all. The "popular" language which is supposedly called Hindi consists of at least one-third of English vocabulary. In fact there is more difference between Hariyanvi and Standard Hindi than between Urdu and Hindi at the spoken level. Then why the need for separate Hindi and Urdu wikipediae?

And why do we always judge popularity by the big cities. In small cities/towns and villages, the literate people still use Devanagari numerals. (As I have said, this debate is endless. Just leave the system as it is. Use redirects.)Maquahuitl २१:०२, ३ मई २००७ (UTC)

        When someone searches on Google, what form will they use?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १०:४७, ६ मई २००७ (UTC)

### [संपादित करें] Finally! I get an "official" article on this!

Finally, I have found an "official" article about this:

http://rajbhasha.nic.in/consthin.htm in Hindi or

http://rajbhasha.nic.in/consteng.htm in English.

Here is the extract in English:

(1) The official language of the Union shall be Hindi in Devnagari script. The form of numerals to be used for the official purposes of the Union shall be the international form of Indian numerals. (2) Notwithstanding anything in clause (1), for a period of fifteen years from the commencement of this Constitution, the English language shall continue to be used for all the official purposes of the Union for which it was being used immediately before such commencement:

Provided that the President may, during the said period, by order authorise the use of the Hindi language in addition to the English language and of the Devnagari form of numerals in addition to the internationl form of Indian numerals for any of the official purposes of the Union.

(3) Notwithstanding anything in this article, Parliament may be law provide for the use, after the said period of fifteen years, of-

(a) the English language, or (b) the Devnagari form of numerals,

for such purposes as may be specified in the law.

and in Hindi:

अनुच्छेद 343. संघ की राजभाषा--

(1) संघ की राजभाषा हिंदी और लिपि देवनागरी होगी, संघ के शासकीय प्रयोजनों के लिए प्रयोग होने वाले अंकों का रूप भारतीय अंकों का अंतर्राष्ट्रीय रूप होगा।

(2) खंड (1) में किसी बात के होते हुए भी, इस संविधान के प्रारंभ से पंद्रह वर्ष की अवधि तक संघ के उन सभी शासकीय प्रयोजनों के लिए अंग्रेजी भाषा का प्रयोग किया जाता रहेगा जिनके लिए उसका ऐसे प्रारंभ से ठीक पहले प्रयोग किया जा रहा था :

परन्तु राष्ट्रपति उक्त अवधि के दौरान, आदेश द्वारा, संघ के शासकीय प्रयोजनों में से किसी के लिए अंग्रेजी भाषा के अतिरिक्त हिंदी भाषा का और भारतीय अंकों के अंतर्राष्ट्रीय रूप के अतिरिक्त देवनागरी रूप का प्रयोग प्राधिकृत कर सकेगा।

(3) इस अनुच्छेद में किसी बात के होते हुए भी, संसद् उक्त पन्द्रह वर्ष की अवधि के पश्चात्‌, विधि द्वारा

(क) अंग्रेजी भाषा का, या

(ख) अंकों के देवनागरी रूप का,

ऐसे प्रयोजनों के लिए प्रयोग उपबंधित कर सकेगी जो ऐसी विधि में विनिर्दिष्ट किए जाएं।

Please give your comments.--वुल्फ़वार्ता १५:३२, ८ मई २००७ (UTC)

  I also found this:

  जैसा कि समिति का सुझाव है केन्द्रीय मंत्रालयों का हिन्दी प्रकाशनों में अन्तर्राष्ट्रीय अंकों के अतिरिक्त देवनागरी अंकों के प्रयोग के सम्बन्ध में एक आधारभूत नीति अपनाई जाए, जिसका निर्धारण इस आधार पर किया जाए कि वे प्रकाशन किस प्रकार की जनता के लिए हैं और उसकी विषयवस्तु क्या है। वैज्ञानिक, औद्योगिक और सांख्यिकीय प्रकाशनों में, जिसमें केन्द्रीय सरकार का बजट सम्बन्धी साहित्य भी शामिल है, बराबर अन्तर्राष्ट्रीय अंकों का प्रयोग किया जाए।

  Numerals - As suggested by the Committee, a uniform basic policy should be adopted for the use of Devanagari numerals, in addition to the international numerals, in the Hindi publications of the Central Ministries depending upon the public intended to be addressed and the subject-matter of the publication. For scientific, technical and statistical publications, including the international numerals should be adopted uniformly in all publications.

  here: http://rajbhasha.nic.in/preseng.htm (English) and http://rajbhasha.nic.in/preshin.htm (Hindi).--वुल्फ़वार्ता १५:३५, ८ मई २००७ (UTC)
    That looks as good as we're going to get. I think we should use the Hindu-Arabic numerals described by the government as Indian International Numerals. They're essentially India developed anyway. But I will also defer to others if they prefer to keep using the devanagari numerals. - टैक्सवाला १७:५०, ८ मई २००७ (UTC)

      If you're using the popularity argument, then why not have a proper vote here as well? Create a page and keep it open to vote till say, 100 votes. Maquahuitl २१:५१, ९ मई २००७ (UTC)

        I don't think anyone is using the popularity argument, and I still don't think a vote will be a good idea. I had thought I will get others' comments before voting either way. I still think there are two distinct issues here - which numbers to use inside articles, and which ones to use for internal Wikipedia pages and automated dates (those at the end of signatures, for example.)
        The above links posted by Wolfji do clear up the issue of what numerals to use inside articles - technical articles use Hindu-Arabic numerals, others use whatever is seen fit for the reading audience. I suppose that will mean using Devanagari numerals in articles on literature, history, biographies, geography etc. But that discretion should be left to the original article creator (similar to the English vs American spelling debate).
        However, this still leaves the question of what numerals to use in internal Wikipedia pages and automated dates. I guess for this issue the 'audience' will be the contributors, since they are the ones mostly looking at the automated numbers. So I propose we look at it from a different angle - which one of the two are the contributors (present and future) more (or less) comfortable working with. I am comfortable with both, as are most of the current contributors, I think. As for future contributors, most of those in India with internet access know both numerals. Actually, even some Hindi-speaking educated folks might have trouble with Devanagari numerals, especially those educated in English medium schools. I am sure the contributors coming from outside India are more likely have a problem with Devanagari numerals, while Hindu-Arabic numerals are almost globally known.
        So, my vote(s) - technical articles use Hindu-Arabic numerals, keep it flexible for other articles; Hindu-Arabic numerals for automated numbers. -- दाढ़ीकेश १६:२०, १० मई २००७ (UTC)

I have completely changed my mind now. Dadhikeshji's idea is great, or, since I have been doing a bit of research in both books and on the Internet, I think the usage of Devanagari numerals is good. Devanagari numerals are used in more formal and important content; and what is more formal and important than an encyclopedia? आपका विचार क्या है?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १६:३०, १० मई २००७ (UTC)

  But then again, so much work has been done in Hindu Arabic numerals. Or, you could use साँचा:संख्या... roll your mouse over this: १०००? But Dadhikheshji's idea is probably the best.--वुल्फ़वार्ता १४:०२, ११ मई २००७ (UTC)

## [संपादित करें] Insert a phonetic toolbar

namaskaar,
फ़ोनेटिक प्रणाली को जल्दी से जल्दी हिंदी वीकीपिड़िया मे लाने का प्रयास कीजिये . यह बड़ा अच्छा उपाय होगा | means people who want to contribute in hindi but do not know how to write in hindi on internet will also be contributing jab aap(administrators) phonetic toolbar insert karna to vishaal pad:see se idea lena naa bhuliyega isme jab aap koi shabd type karte hai to yah apne aap 'अ' ki matra ko jod deta hai isse ant me 'a' nahi type karna padta eg : normaly kisi aur pad pe aap type karenge sumita for writing सुमित but on vishal pad u need to type only sumit --सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

  I am actually trying to maintain a single input system for all the Devnagari wikipediae. While the Vishaaljee's system looks good for Hindi, its not suitable for Nepal Bhasa as there are a lot of words in Nepal Bhasa which end in half letters. If there are more advantages of having Vishaljee's system, we can use it as well. Also, the phonetic system that I have used is very similar to Gamabhana system. So, we might need to add a few lines for Baraha and itrans users which are the two of the most used systems, as far as I know. If someone likes to try out the phonetic system, it is available at Nepal Bhasa wikipedia. Please suggest and comment about the phonetic system esp about its limitations. Thank you. --युकेश १६:११, १६ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
    I think something similar to http://www.guruji.com/ (Guruji; click on हिन्दी) would be good. Eukeshji, would you be able to develop something like that?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १५:०७, १७ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  Boy, we do follow a lot of input systems. I thought it was just itrans, gamabhana and baraha! I would really be grateful if you people could have a look at the input system in Nepal Bhasa and tell me what is needed to improve it. If it is radically different from what you people need, please notify me. Thanks.--युकेश १६:२१, १७ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

    OK, here's my suggestion:

अ आ इ ई उ ऊ ऋ ए ऐ ओ औ ऑ ऍ (in case of writing Marathi)

a A/aa i I/ee u U/oo rri e AI o AU O E

क ख ग घ ङ

k kh g gh NG

च छ ज झ ञ

ch/c chh j jh NY

ट ठ द ध न

T Th d dh n

प फ ब भ म

p ph/f b bh m

य र ल व

y r l v/w

श ष स ह

sh/S Sh s h

क़ ख़ ग़ ज़ ड़ ढ़ फ़ ळ

q Kh G z R Rh F L

ँ ं ः । . ् ़

^ M H ../.` . ,, `.

क्ष ज्ञ ंक ंग

kSh Gy nk ng

For example: writing mAikrosOFT should produce माइक्रोसॉफ़्ट, writing vishwaGyaanakoSh should produce विश्वज्ञानकोष. And you shouldn't need to write a after every word (as Sumitji said) to get rid of the Halant/Viram. What do you think?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १७:०९, १७ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

In my view it is good try this from vishaal pad:see --सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

  I have been a bit busy lately so couldnt answer here. The phonetic script shares soruce with all other wikipediae enabled in Devnagari i.e. Nepal Bhasa, Nepali, Pali, Bhojpuri, Kashmiri and Marathi wiktionary. The use of automatic completion of last letter is not suitable for Nepal Bhasa and Nepali as there are a lot of words which end in half form such as य्, छन्, गर्छन्, झन् etc. Also, Vishal pad does not have input for some of the characters used in Kashmiri. Plus, the use of inout outside the alphabetic characters should be as limited as possible as they have specific functions. eg- the use of pipe (|) prevented many actions so we had to change it. So, as far as possible, lets try to minimize the use of ^ / etc. About the use of c and ch for च् , I am working on it (I am not a programmer and no where even close to programming world and operate by hit and trial method so it takes time for me to come up with something). About the use of NG, NY, I think that after using the phonetic system for a while, you will feel the need to remove the N from both as the typing is too slow with phonetic system. Typing an extra N slows it even more. One cannot have both NG and G for ङ् for the same technical limitation as for ch and c at the moment. I dont know much abt nufta, so I allocated a separate space for it just like in Gamabhana. Currently, we are using x for क्ष्. I think we can include ksh as well. Besides these, there are a few technical limitations and task of incorporation of all Devnagari symbols is still not complete. The current input system is just a beginning. We have a long way to go. For the logn term management of the Devnagari input system, I have started a page in Metawiki. I hope we can have participation from all Devnagari communities there and enhance our input system. Thank you.--युकेश १६:५३, २० अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

    I don't find the following consistent- ए=e ऎ=E. In fact it should be other way round since the first one is long and the second one short. Same for ओ/ऒ. फ=fa? झ=za?. Incorrect. Also how is ज्ञ=Jha? Also य़ cannot be = Ya. Its pronounciation is that of 's' in 'vision'.Maquahuitl ११:४३, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

      In my opinion, the input system is supposed to be hinghly influenced by phonetic system but not dictated by it. The aim is to ease the input of Devnagari. ए is used more often than ऎ, so it is prudent to use e than E (with shift pressed) for the former. Same for ओ/ऒ and fa (simpler than pha). If z is idle (no devnagari keys assigned), it is better to have झ assigned to z with additional jh for the same as well (phonetic based system are very slow to type and assignment of z reduces typing one more letter). I think that Jha for ज्ञ might be a bit less suitable. It is usually pronounced as Gya in the north and Jna in the south. I have no idea of the use of nuftas so no comments on Ya. Plus, one suggestion for Mawuahuitljee and others, no offence meant but please tone down a little when commenting on the input systems. I dont personally know Vishaljee or Omkar Joshijee of Gamabhana or any other people who are developing these systems. However, these people are generally young programmers who are striving hard for the survival of Devnagari. They work day and night for the input system and provide their product to us, free of cost. And we respond by labelling them "incorrect" and other such terms. Its a bit counter-productive at times. So, I think it might be a good idea to discuss what input system should be in place like this and then suggest about it to the programmer/developer. Please pardon me if I have offended anyone. Thanks. --युकेश १५:३२, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

    युकेश plz insert th tolbar quickly the shortcommings will be disscused after u will insert th toolbar--सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

## [संपादित करें] Criterion for listing on left hand side

English wiki lists wikis with more than 25,000 articles. Is there any criterion for selection here?

I suggest we have two lists(one below the other), one of which has all the Indian languages listed. Maquahuitl १०:२६, २३ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  That is a good idea, but we need to program it then. Also, the English one doesn't list the Germanic languages and the Swedish doesn't list the Scandinavian languages. But still, I think it's a good idea. Can you program it for us?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १५:२७, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

## [संपादित करें] buttons

dear , administrators how other wikipediae like marathimarathi:seehave put many buttons in their edit window?If it can be done here also ,plz do it.--सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

  The more buttons we put the longer it takes to load the page. So, lets put the edit buttons judiciously. I have been experimenting with edit buttons in Nepal Bhasa. I think it would not be much problem for us to have all the edit keys of Marathi wikipedia, but do we really need all of them? Please comment. Thank you. --युकेश १६:५७, २० अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
    ऐसी कोइ अतिआवश्यक्ता नही है | धन्यवाद--सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

## [संपादित करें] नाम

श्रेणी:फ़िजि भार्तिये लोग का नाम फ़िजी निवासित भारतीय व्यक्ति रख देना चाहिये ।
और 'redirectedfrom' => '($1 से भेजा गया)',
से 'redirectedfrom' => '($1 से अनुप्रेषित किया गया)',
कर देना चाहिये | --सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

  How about पुनर्निर्देश for redirect (as Marathi/Bengali have used)? But I don't know Hindi to well, so I think changing भेजना to अनुप्रेषित is a good idea.--वुल्फ़वार्ता १३:०९, २२ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
    http://www.cfilt.iitb.ac.in/~hdict/webinterface_user/dict_search_user.php इस वेबपेज पर जा कर redirect का अर्थ देखें दो अर्थ दिये है पर उनका वाक्यों मे प्रयोग का जो उदाहरण दिया है उसे सम्झें तो पाएंगे कि अनुप्रेषित ज्यादा साही है ।--सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

      पुनर्निर्देशित sounds very correct and quite understandable to an average Hindi speaker. अनुप्रेषित is rather heavy and afaik not needed. Maquahuitl १०:२२, २३ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
    पुनर्निर्देशित is a wrong term to be used here as it means something re-constructed (something like tht but अनुप्रेषित which is accurate means sending from one address to another see in the link provided above--सुमित सिन्हावार्ता
      पुनः = again, निर्देशन= direction then I don't understand how it is wrong. Maquahuitl ०३:४९, २५ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

Mr.Maquahuitl, please follow this http://www.cfilt.iitb.ac.in/~hdict/webinterface_user/dict_search_user.php link and type 'redirect' in the text box the meaning(s)(must be said translation) which u will see would be having a sentence written by their side . kindly,read them . then u will encounter the correct word for rediect(to be used here) i.e. अनुप्रेषित .and it is also understandable thanks for reading - --सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

      सुमित जी दोनों शब्द सही हैं पर पुनर्निर्देशित अधिक सरल है और सभी लोग इसे आसानी से समझ जायेंगे। अनुप्रेषित का प्रयोग इस संदर्भ में उतना सामान्य नहीं प्रतीत होता।
      --मनीष वशिष्ठ
        Guys this is a done deal, I have already used "anupreShita" as the default word for redirect per the Mumbai dictionary. See {{श्रेणीअनुप्रेषित}}.राजा रामबात करो ०२:३५, २८ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
  'श्रेणी:फ़िजि भार्तिये लोग' का नाम 'श्रेणी:फ़िजी निवासित भारतीय व्यक्ति' रख देना चाहिये Please give your views on this topic also --सुमित सिन्हावार्ता
    श्रेणी:आवाज़ लेख's name shall be changed to श्रेणी:श्रुति . श्रुति's meaning is "Knowledge in The form of speech".Express your views --सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

## [संपादित करें] Slow progress of Hindi wikipedia

Hindi wikipedia is stuck up at the last spot of the 10,000 list and more and more wikis are passing by it. Among Indian languages Tamil which was recently 8,000 has now almost equalled Hindi and Nepal Bhasha has left Hindi far behind. Something needs to be done :) Maquahuitl १७:१४, २८ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  मेरा विचार वही नहीं है। हिंदी विकिपीडिया के लिए 10,000 लेख एक बहूत अच्छा टॉप-स्पॉट है, और अब सब सदस्य लेखों के क्वालिटी पर फ़ोकस दे रहे है। जैसे अब विकिपीडिया पर क़रीब-क़रीब 3 निर्वाचित लेख है, ये है रामायण (यह निर्वाचित है), महादेवी वर्मा (अभी आलोचना हो रहा है तस्वीरें की बारे में यह देखे) और सत्यजित राय (इसमें सिर्फ़ दो पैरग्राफ़ अनुवाद कर ज़रूरी है, और लाल लिंकों की नीला करना)। अब महादेवी वर्मा की एक बहूत अच्छी क्वालिटी लेख की सिलेक्शन है, और नया सदस्य (जैसे सुमित सिन्हा) भी अच्छे लेख बनाते हैं। लेखों के क्वालिटी के हिसाव से (एक-वाक्य लेख इत्यादि) 10,325 लेख की संख्या मेरा विचार में काफ़ी है :-)।--वुल्फ़वार्ता १७:३७, २८ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
  Thanks for noticing. Its been a bit slow at the moment. But then, the regular editors are working on polishing the articles that are present at the moment. One of our commitments was to increase the depth and quality rather than number after reaching 10k. I am the only contributor in Nepal Bhasa. I have been using bots there to create meaningful stubs. Once we reach a state where we have double digits of featured articles and after expanding most of the oneliners, we can proceed ahead with those articles here. So, the next time you see the list, simply add 5000 articles more to Hindi and compare! :) --युकेश १७:४०, २८ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
    My concern was light hearted and not very serious :)- you could have made that out probably by the smiley there at the end.
    This quality versus quantity debate often comes up. I would say neither is unimportant. But the problem is when to look for quality and when to increase quantity. I repeat what I said in the earlier archive. It is a decent proposal in this regard. The FA percentage on English wikipedia is 0.077% or approximately 0.08%. We can aim a 0.1% FA article figure which will mean that we should have had about 10 FA by now or by English figure about 8 FAs. So current concern should be quality definitely. (I know I am talking too much, but I am just waiting for my exams to get over. I definitely hope to translate a lot of FAs from WP India in English wiki in the summers :).) Maquahuitl २०:१३, २८ अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

    I agree that quality is more important here.I think, having 10,338 articles itself is great achievement. Quantity as a statistic does encourage you to contribute and take it to higher level. Hindi wikipedia is at no 60 in number of articles. Out of those 10000+ articles we have only 3200+ articles that contain at least one internal link and 200 (ja,ko,zh:50) characters readable text, disregarding wiki- and html codes, hidden links, etc.; also headers do not count. I think numbers are very consistent with number of users we have. May be our focus should be to get more users and we all can help in that regard. We can suggest/promote Hindi wikipedia to our hindi speaking/knowing friends and they may want to help. We don't need any promotion from wikipedia but a collective effort from existing users to promote it.

    - http://stats.wikimedia.org/EN/ChartsWikipediaHI.htm
    - http://stats.wikimedia.org/EN/TablesWikipediaHI.htm

    We have one page for count, and I was wondering if we can put some of these graphs there. It's a good idea to see how Hindi wikipedia is moving and gaining momentum. With the pace we had in February-March 2007, I thought we could reach 50000 by the end of year, and we still can. But we need more contributors.
    Thanks मनीष वशिष्ठ 14:47, 30 अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)
      The graphs on that first link are great. Definitely show we are making progess. Badai ho to everyone. I do think that at this point higher quality articles will attract more new users than a higher number of articles. And we're definitely making strides in article improvement, so keep up the good work, and do send as many Hindi speakers as you can how to edit. - टैक्सवाला २२:०४, १ मई २००७ (UTC)

## [संपादित करें] विकिपीडिया सहयोग

मैं यहाँ एक नया विकिपीडिया समाज-पृष्ठ तैयर करता हूँ अंतरविकि सहयोग कोशिश करने लिए। कृपया विकिपीडिया:विकिपीडिया सहयोग देखें।--वुल्फ़वार्ता १५:३६, ३० अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

## [संपादित करें] help

Seeing the category for Category:Chinese numbered policies which includes the pancasila treaty India signed with china in 1954 I have hit a stumbling block. There is no "numbered" word in any of the five hindi dictionaries I checked. I was thinking something like "Category:चीनी नीतियाँ-ए-संख्या" (chinese policies of number) but that would of course be persian-esque and urdu sounding. This is not the first nor the last time something like this will occur, so it seems fitting to discuss this now. I personally do not care whether the hindi we use is "urdu-esque" if it allows for greater flexibility. On pages I write related to Iran, I use persoarabic words liberally because they are generally found in hindi conversation as well.राजा रामबात करो १६:५७, ३० अप्रैल २००७ (UTC)

  Would a good translation for Chinese policies of number be चीनी संख्याएँ की नीतियाँ?--वुल्फ़वार्ता ०७:१६, १ मई २००७ (UTC)

    I would suggest either plain चीनी संख्या नीतियाँ or गिनती वाली चीनी नीतियाँ. -- दाढ़ीकेश ०१:१७, २ मई २००७ (UTC)

      No matter what the commonalities between Hindi and Urdu be, this is one rare defining attribute which distinguishes Hindi and Urdu. In Hindi the -e- and -o- constructs, known as idafat and waw-e-atf are never used. Another rare defining attribute is the usage of Arabic and Persian plurals verbatim like afsar(officer)->afsaraan etc. in Urdu. In Hindi it is not acceptable. These things are perhaps the only few real differences between Hindi and Urdu. Maquahuitl २१:१०, ३ मई २००७ (UTC)
        That's interesting. I can't seem to find any articles on the -e- and -o- constructs. For example en:idafat and en:waw-e-atf don't exist and I don't know how to spell them in devanagari. Do you have links to more info? - टैक्सवाला १५:५९, २२ मई २००७ (UTC)

        The articles aren't there because you won't have articles for such internal details of a language. You can just transliterate them as इदाफ़त and वाओ-ए-अत्फ़.Maquahuitl १७:२२, २४ मई २००७ (UTC)

## [संपादित करें] निर्वाचित तस्वीर

कृपया निर्वाचित तस्वीर मई२००७ चेक करें। धन्यवाद।--वुल्फ़वार्ता ०७:४२, १ मई २००७ (UTC)

  The template is protected from editing. See here for a good suggestion: वार्ता:मुखपृष्ठ. I would also suggest changing ज्यादा निर्वाचित तस्वीर to अन्य निर्वाचित तस्वीरें. -- दाढ़ीकेश ०१:२२, २ मई २००७ (UTC)
    Is it? On my "toolbar" there is still a button saying "सुरक्षित करे" - which means that it isn't protected. It is only protected to those who aren't logged in (मुखपृष्ठ cascading).--वुल्फ़वार्ता १३:५४, २ मई २००७ (UTC)
      I think for cascading protection the admin interface still says protect. I'm not sure that tab checks if it's already protected due to cascading protection, just regular protection. Worth filing a mediawiki bug report if there isn't already one on it. Though it seems on en.wiki cascading protected pages do give me the unprotect tab, so perhaps it's due to a translation issue. साँचा:निर्वाचित तस्वीर मई२००७ is definitely cascading protected though so non admins can't edit it. - टैक्सवाला १८:२६, २ मई २००७ (UTC)

Thanks for the suggestion :-)! But when you tried to edit it, were you logged in?--वुल्फ़वार्ता १३:५५, २ मई २००७ (UTC)

  I am logged in now, it's still showing me only the source. It says it is automatically protected because it's transcluded on the main page. Maybe that's the reason. Last month I edited it before it went on the front page and had no problem. -- दाढ़ीकेश १५:१९, २ मई २००७ (UTC)
    Yes, since the Main page is protected with the cascading protection, templates transcluded on it are protected. That's a good thing for vandalism, but means that admins have to take suggestions for needed changes to those templates and actually make the edits. - टैक्सवाला १८:२८, २ मई २००७ (UTC)
      I have changed the template, but it still says "सुरक्षित करें" and when I click on it it takes me to the protection page.--वुल्फ़वार्ता १८:३०, २ मई २००७ (UTC)

## [संपादित करें] ज्ञान पहेली मुखपृष्ठ पर

पिछले महीने मैंने विकिपीडिया पर एक ज्ञान पहेली शुरु की थी जिसकी मदद से कई लेखों में सुधार हुआ। पिछले कुछ दिनों से इसमें जोश की कुछ कमी हो गई है। मेरा सुझाव है कि इसे मुखपृष्ठ पर डाला जाए, जिससे यह और सदस्यों की नजर में आए। मैंने इसके पन्ने पर कुछ बदलाव किए हैं जिससे खुला प्रश्न और पिछला प्रश्न (उत्तर के साथ) मुखपृष्ठ पर डाला जा सकता है, इस तरह -

प्रश्न: प्रसिद्ध हॉलीवुड फ़िल्म निर्देशक एल्फ़्रेड हिचकॉक की सभी फ़िल्मों में एक विशेष समानता है जो सुभाष घई की सभी फ़िल्मों में भी है। बताएँ क्या। (उत्तर यहाँ दें)

  पिछला प्रश्न: इन लोगों में क्या समानता है ? एरियूस (en:Arius), ज़िनेदीन ज़िदान (en:Zinedine Zidane) , एदिथ पियाफ (en:Édith Piaf), मुहम्मद शुकरी (en:Mohamed Choukri) , इबन बतूता (en:Ibn Battuta), संत एगस्टीन (हिपो वाले) (en:Augustine of Hippo). (उत्तर: सभी उत्तरी अफ़्रीका की बर्बर जाति (en:Berber people) से हैं या इनके पूर्वज बर्बर थे।)

जब भी नया प्रश्न पूछा जाएगा इसे बदल दिया जाएगा। इससे मुखपृष्ठ पर नियमित रूप से नई सामग्री दिखती रहेगी, और इसमें जिन लेखों का जिक्र होता है उनको सुधारने का मौका मिलेगा। इसके बारे में सबका क्या विचार है मैं जानना चाहूँगा। -- दाढ़ीकेश ०२:०८, २ मई २००७ (UTC)

  यह बहुत अच्छा विचार है मैं इसके समर्थन मे हुँ।--सुमित सिन्हावार्ता

    मैं जानता नहीं हूँ, लेकिन कृपया यह देखे: अंग्रेज़ी विकिपीडिया पर "विकिपीडिया क्या नहीं है" और ज्ञान पहेली एक प्रकार सोशल नेटवर्किंग तो है। विकिपीडिया के साधारण पृष्ठ पर हो सकता है, लेकिन मैं मुखपृष्ठ के लिए जानता नहीं है।--वुल्फ़वार्ता १३:५२, २ मई २००७ (UTC)

      ज्ञान पहेली सोशल नेटवर्किंग से ज़्यादा सामान्य ज्ञान बढ़ाने का एक जरिया है। ऊपर दिये लिंक में कहीं लिखा नहीं है कि ट्रिविया या पहेलियों के पन्ने विकिपीडिया के मिशन से मेल नहीं खाते। मेरा विचार है कि यह ज्ञान को फैलाने के विकिपीडिया के मिशन से बहुत मेल खाता है। साथ ही हिन्दी विकिपीडिया को इससे निस्संदेह फायदा होगा। जैसा मैंने ऊपर कहा, ज्ञान पहेली के पहले 6-7 प्रश्नों से ही कई लेख नए बने और कई और काफी बढ़ गए हैं। उदाहरण के लिए चीन की महान दीवार, चार्ल्स द्वितीय, कैथरीन दे ब्रागान्ज़ा, झाँसी की रानी, जयन्त विष्णु नार्लीकर, फ्रेड हॉयल, प्रुशिया, "ऋषभ", "गान्धार", "धैवत्", "निषाद" इत्यादि। -- दाढ़ीकेश २१:३३, २ मई २००७ (UTC)

        अन्य सभी का क्या विचार है? - दाढ़ीकेश १५:५५, १० मई २००७ (UTC)

## [संपादित करें] मिस वर्ल्ड या विश्व सुंदरी

हमको प्रतियोगिता का नाम नहीं बदलना चाहिये क्योंकि उसे वैसे ही संबोधित किया जाता है। आप लोगों का क्या ख्याल है? जिस तरह से फ़िल्म शब्द का इस्तेमाल हुआ है उसी तरह से मिस वर्ल्ड को उसी रूप में स्वीकार करना चाहिये। --द डॉनमेरी वार्ता १३:२९, १० मई २००७ (UTC)

  इस बारे में दोनों तरफ दलीलें दी जा सकती हैं। नाम वह रखा जाना चाहिये जिसे हिन्दी-भाषी जनता अधिक प्रयोग करती है। इसे जानने का एक तरीका है गूगल खोज पर देखें कि कौन सा नाम हिन्दी मीडिया में अधिक प्रयुक्त होता है। "मिस वर्ल्ड" के लिए करीब 500 और "विश्व सुंदरी" के लिए करीब 250 और "विश्व सुन्दरी" के लिए 1420 खोज परिणाम है। सो मेरा विचार है कि लेख का नाम "विश्व सुन्दरी" होना चाहिए और अन्य नामों को पुनर्निर्देशित किया जाना चाहिये। -- दाढ़ीकेश १५:५३, १० मई २००७ (UTC)
    आपका सुझाव अच्छा है दाढ़ीकेश जी पर उस हिसाब से इसका नाम मिस वर्ल्ड होना चाहिये
    मिस वर्ल्ड => 535 परिणाम
    विश्व सुंदरी => 239 परिणाम
    विश्व सुन्दरी => 93 परिणाम
    हमको पूरे नाम को खोज़ना पड़ेगा । अन्यथा परिणाम केवल सुंदरी एवं विश्व पर भी आधारित हो सकते हैं। हमको double quotes में डालकर खोज़ना पड़ेगा --द डॉनमेरी वार्ता 18:30, १० मई २००७ (UTC)
      "विश्वसुंदरी" का 20 परिणाम है, और "विश्वसुन्दरी" का 13 परिणाम है।--वुल्फ़वार्ता १३:४९, ११ मई २००७ (UTC)
        मेरे ख्य़ाल से इसका नाम मिस वर्ल्ड एवं मिस यूनीवर्स होना चाहिये । कम से कम ब्रह्माण्ड सुन्दरी तो बिल्कुल नहीं होना चाहिये। विश्व सुन्दरी एक शब्द नहीं है और इस तरह प्रयोग भी नहीं किया जाना चाहिये। |--मनीष वशिष्ठमेरी वार्ता

"http://hi.wikipedia.org../../../%E0%A4%9A/%E0%A5%8C/%E0%A4%AA/%E0%A4%B5%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%95%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%AA%E0%A5%80%E0%A4%A1%E0%A4%BF%E0%A4%AF%E0%A4%BE%7E%E0%A4%9A%E0%A5%8C%E0%A4%AA%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%B2_%E0%A4%AA%E0%A5%81%E0%A4%B0%E0%A4%BE%E0%A4%B2%E0%A5%87%E0%A4%96_3_c51f.html" से लिया गया

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